Uber-light turbo killerbocks?

[PaulH]

Many thanks for the advice - maybe I'll just get the pros, then.  (Typical Noobie - can barely walk and already wants new toys!)

[Jason]

Right I did miss a few bits

For the average person skip springs in skips will last just as long if not a bit longer, tundraH the spring slayer has a knack of breaking them and so does Kiola but as I have seen tundra hop onto a 4ft horse from a walk I am not surprised lets just hope he never kicks me  and just watch Kiola's vids to see why

It is possible to bolt your shoes to the fixed footplate on any of the Bocks and it is possible to fit a footplate to any of the Bocks (even the articulate Skip Pros I've got a set next to me with a PJ footplate on it) getting the back strap to fit is a bit of magic but I will tell anyone who wants to know 

All the weight savings on the Skips are due to the materials used He30 is a very light alloy and they use steel clamps on the kneebars
Strangely the kneebars are almost the same as the PJ ones and I didn't notice much difference in weight as I cut them down to use as cuffies 

The yellow pixie boots are much lighter than bindings and footplate but my feet were really to big for them (but they are for the bindings to )

And heres the pic of the moving foot with a PJ footplate

Jason 

[PaulH]

OK - I'm going to try re-engineering the top half of my bocks - the big square upright and the bend tubes that make up the knee cuffs.  I think there's a lot of unnecessary weight because they are designed to be adjustable.  Before I go an break a leg, has anyone seen any radical redesigns of these parts?  If only so I can see what doesn't work...

Paul

[Spud]

Not seen anything different but I am not sure that making the kneebar/cuff bar part so that it doesn't adjust is such a good idea in weight saving. I personally think there are other parts of the bocks that could be changed without any downsides where as with the cuff bars you lose something. A year on I am still adjusting mine. I actually just got them in the perfect position but who knows, in a couple of months might need changing again...

Anyway..If you do this go for it. But I suggest that you do it with a knee bar apposed to calf cuffs because calf cuffs are so hard to get set up perfectly. If you cant adjust it and don't do it right then it could be a problem for you. With the knee bar you only have to get the height right. Not as secure but probably better for this.

Have you weight parts to see what could be saved. i think you would be surprised how little weight you will saved from that part alone. That is unless you are redesigning parts completely?

 

[Jason]

The main weight saving in the upright on Skips is that they have drilled twice as many lightening holes and that makes a lot of difference

Jason 

[PaulH]

Not seen anything different but I am not sure that making the kneebar/cuff bar part so that it doesn't adjust is such a good idea in weight saving. I personally think there are other parts of the bocks that could be changed without any downsides where as with the cuff bars you lose something. A year on I am still adjusting mine. I actually just got them in the perfect position but who knows, in a couple of months might need changing again...

Anyway..If you do this go for it. But I suggest that you do it with a knee bar apposed to calf cuffs because calf cuffs are so hard to get set up perfectly. If you cant adjust it and don't do it right then it could be a problem for you. With the knee bar you only have to get the height right. Not as secure but probably better for this.

Have you weight parts to see what could be saved. i think you would be surprised how little weight you will saved from that part alone. That is unless you are redesigning parts completely?

 

Point taken about the adjustment, but since I got cuffs I haven't felt the need to adjust them, and I'll take the risk.  And I'll be going for cuffs (not a bar) because I think they are more comfortable than the knee bar and safer when you fall.  It may take a few tries to get them spot on, but that's OK.  Plan is basically to (a) replace the big square upright with better alloy, lighter (b) make a one-piece curvey-Y piece to replace the two bent tubes of the existing cuffs (c) the stem of the "Y" fixes to the front face of the square upright rather than the sides (d) Fix it permanently (bolts to begin with; TIG-welded when I get it right) (e) curve the side-pieces (the parts that sit on the left and right of the knee) to give a more comfortable grip when the knee strap is tightened.   (f) fix the two tension rods (the narrow diagonal threaded rods that brace the heel at 90 degrees to the upright) to the big square upright directly instead of into the great big adjustment block.   I'm taking measurements from my existing set-up to ensure that all the contact points and angles are the same, and I'll mock up the pipe sections in copper (cheap and easy to bend) before I make the real ones in alu alloy.  I figure I'll save about 450-500 grams per bok if I'm lucky, and get a more comfortable knee support to boot.

Of course all this weight is saved at the top of the bok, whereas you really want savings at the bottom.  But that comes later.

I've now learned to run in the things, so I notice the weight more.  I think the existing design is semi-optimal for stunts, but not optimal where you want light weight for running.  It's a bit like a mountain bike versus a racer.

[toddy]

(d) Fix it permanently (bolts to begin with; TIG-welded when I get it right)

I've now learned to run in the things, so I notice the weight more.  I think the existing design is semi-optimal for stunts, but not optimal where you want light weight for running.  It's a bit like a mountain bike versus a racer.

now i would not surgest to weld it together, even tho it would be better, but it would be alotr more likely to fracture unless you normilise it after wards and get the welding perfect, unless you will get loads of defects that are really hard to get rid of.

if anything i would just use u bolts on it.#

and the bike stuff, it is more like a cheep bike(apolo to a yeti(£100 bike to a £4000 bike)
and a racer styal bock i would not want due to it would brake if you did one wrong move

[PaulH]

Hmmm - interesting.  You think a weld is worse than bolts?  You probably have more experience in this than I do, so many thanks for the suggestion.  I was assuming that bolts would cause high local stresses compared to welds, but I guess welds cause greater metallurgical problems.

And yes, about making something that would break with a wrong move.  But, conventional bocks are designed to allow all kinds of extreme maneuvers.  I am more interested in creating something which is ideal for walking and running, but maybe not suited for extreme moves.  After all, it would be very surprising if there were a single optimal design for all styles of use, no?

[toddy]

well since i am a coded welder i di know about the weak points of a weld.

but unless you want to spend lo0ads normolising it i wouldnt do it